Why cant you for once just admit that I have a pretty good point here?
It would go some way to dismissing in deed rather than word the accusation that you are actually paid to spin on this site.
One more time:
Do you agree that the current methodology for ascertaining "homeownership rates" is deeply flawed if your research question is: how many adults own their own home either individually or jointly?
Because, the fact of the matter is, and feel free to disagree most people would take "home ownership rates" to mean (rightly or wrongly) the rate of home ownership among the general adult population, not the percentage of dwellings that are owned by one persons irrespective of how many other adults were living there.
Go on, for once, deviate from your core message.
It would be refreshing.
Shadow's core modus operandi is "never admit defeat".
He does occasionally stop fighting when clearly beaten, but his preferred method is to change the terms of debate ex post facto, e.g. to claim victory where none has been had, or even to claim his opponent now agrees with him, when nothing is further from the case.
That's like saying 'do you agree measuring the price of bananas is deeply flawed if your research question is: how much do apples cost?' I don't really care if I'm accused of that. Facts are facts, regardless of who presents them, or their motives.
Okay so here are the facts.
1. 70% of dwellings in Australia are "owner occupied" (abs) 2. This tells us absolutely nothing about how many adults either own a home individually or jointly as a percentage of the entire adult population. It doesn't matter if there is 2 or 20 adults living in a single dwelling as long as one person owns the house it is classified as owner occupied. Even if the 19 non owners are paying rent to the one owner, it is owner occupied.
Are you happy that this is an accurate measure of "home ownership rates" in Australia.
Come on Shadow, deviate from your core message for once.
It will be liberating!
Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?
The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly. Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
1. Children aren't counted in my methodology. 2. Your four flatmates are counted as home owners in the current methodology providing at least one persons living there owns the place. You get that bit right? There could be 15 people in the house all classified as being in a "home ownership" tenure providing the 16th did actually own the joint. 3. Adult children would answer that they don't own a house. Because they don't. they live in the house their parents own. Simples.
Ok so of a family of 4; mum and dad would be owners, infant child no response and adult child answers 'don't own a house'.
Are there 2 categories; own a house or don't own a house Or 3; own a house, rent, don't own or rent a house?
You'll get different information output.
“You Keep Using That Word, I Do Not Think It Means What You Think It Means” - Inigo Montoya
1. 70% of dwellings in Australia are "owner occupied" (abs) 2. This tells us absolutely nothing about how many adults either own a home individually or jointly as a percentage of the entire adult population
It also doesn't tell us how many adults eat cornflakes for breakfast, nor does it attempt to.
1. Children aren't counted in my methodology. 2. Your four flatmates are counted as home owners in the current methodology providing at least one persons living there owns the place. You get that bit right? There could be 15 people in the house all classified as being in a "home ownership" tenure providing the 16th did actually own the joint. 3. Adult children would answer that they don't own a house. Because they don't. they live in the house their parents own. Simples.
Ok so of a family of 4; mum and dad would be owners, infant child no response and adult child answers 'don't own a house'.
Are there 2 categories; own a house or don't own a house Or 3; own a house, rent, don't own or rent a house?
You'll get different information output.
Its really quite simple.
If you are an adult you simply say whether you own the house you live in or not. So this could be the question.
1. Do you own the house you live in either individually or jointly? If no, please tick the box that best describes your situation.
1. I live with my parents 2. I am a renter 3. I live with my child ( think elderly parent)
And so on.
Point is, you either own the place or you don't.
the current system is FUBAR because it doesn't make this distinction.
Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?
The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly. Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
1. Children aren't counted in my methodology. 2. Your four flatmates are counted as home owners in the current methodology providing at least one persons living there owns the place. You get that bit right? There could be 15 people in the house all classified as being in a "home ownership" tenure providing the 16th did actually own the joint. 3. Adult children would answer that they don't own a house. Because they don't. they live in the house their parents own. Simples.
Vritas the ABS collects census data but it also collects the household survey. have a read of the household survey and I thinkyou will find sufficient breakdown of housing tenure in Australia to answer all your questions.
The household survey would certainly measure your growth in the number of people per house.
Definition of a doom and gloomer from 1993 The last camp is made up of the doom-and-gloomers. Their slogan is "it's the end of the world as we know it". Right now they are convinced that debt is the evil responsible for all our economic woes and must be eliminated at all cost. Many doom-and-gloomers believe that unprecedented debt levels mean that we are on the precipice of a worse crisis than the Great Depression. The doom-and-gloomers hang on the latest series of negative economic data.
1. 70% of dwellings in Australia are "owner occupied" (abs) 2. This tells us absolutely nothing about how many adults either own a home individually or jointly as a percentage of the entire adult population
It also doesn't tell us how many adults eat cornflakes for breakfast, nor does it attempt to.
You big baby.
Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?
The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly. Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
Why cant you for once just admit that I have a pretty good point here?
Veritas you have no point here and you still have not bothered to withdraw your claim that children were counted as homeowners as part of the abs data collection. You keep going on about the ABS statistics yet you are wrong and misunderstand each of the statistical terms you have chosen to discuss.
Quote:
Younger persons in a couple relationship were more likely to move into home ownership than younger single people, with 49% of younger couple households owning their home with or without a mortgage. When couples have children they are more likely than younger couple only households to own a home. For couples with dependent children only and their eldest child under 5 years, 64% owned their home with or without a mortgage. This rose to 75% for couples with their eldest child aged 5 to 14, and to 86% for couples with their eldest child aged 15 to 24 (table 16).
Lone person and couple only households with the reference person aged under 35 years were most likely of all life cycle groups to be renting from private landlords (56% and 48% respectively). People in these households are generally more mobile. Many are studying or starting their careers, and are likely to be on lower incomes and have lower reserves of wealth than at later stages in their lives (table 16).
One parent households with dependent children were more likely to be renting (58%) than to own their home (40%), and they were the life cycle group most likely to be renting through a state or territory housing authority (13%) (table 16).
Definition of a doom and gloomer from 1993 The last camp is made up of the doom-and-gloomers. Their slogan is "it's the end of the world as we know it". Right now they are convinced that debt is the evil responsible for all our economic woes and must be eliminated at all cost. Many doom-and-gloomers believe that unprecedented debt levels mean that we are on the precipice of a worse crisis than the Great Depression. The doom-and-gloomers hang on the latest series of negative economic data.
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