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Subprime loans accounted for 10% of Australian mortgages when GFC hit; High-risk 'no-doc' and 'low-doc' loans now officially recognised as sub-prime in the US
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Topic Started: 25 Apr 2011, 03:49 PM (11,621 Views)
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raveswei
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25 Apr 2011, 03:49 PM
Post #1
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Many people arguing that there is and there was no sub-prime lending in Australia.
On 1st July 2007 (earliest day with current web address) Aussie was offering following sub-prime or close to sub-prime mortgages:
http://replay.web.archive.org/20070701112313/http://www.aussie.com.au/Home_Loans_From_Aussie.htm
1. Express Low Doc (Perfect for overcoming the normal paperwork barriers )
1. Aussie Easyloan (Another great choice for a low-documentation loan)
and
3. Non-Conforming Loan (A great option if you have a poor credit rating or those receiving welfare. Also for self-employed customers or those with unusual deposit sources. Even if you want to borrow more than 100% of the property value)
- Quote:
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As a leading mortgage broker, Aussie can help if your financial situation doesn’t fit the standard mould.
These products are great for customers who:
have had a one time incident or event such as an accident, illness, divorce or failed business that has led to financial difficulties and impaired their credit rating
are business owners who have not had the time to prepare or are unable to provide financial statements
fall outside bank policy guidelines
short term employment
gifted deposits
pension or welfare recipients
want to borrow more than 100% of the property value
- Quote:
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Up to 15% of home loans in Australia fall outside of traditional lending criteria. We are delighted to offer some great loan options to make home ownership possible for even more Australians.
http://replay.web.archive.org/20070830071757/http://www.aussie.com.au/NonConforming_Loan.htm
15% of all mortgages in 2007 were sub-prime according to Aussie
Non-Conforming Loans were offered until July 2008.
You can try find something else http://web.archive.org
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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raveswei
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25 Apr 2011, 04:03 PM
Post #2
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Aussie Best Loans Centre
offered Non Conforming Loans first time in Feb 2005
http://replay.web.archive.org/20050308112344/http://www.aussiebestloans.com.au/
they still offer them
http://aussiebestloans.com.au/
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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raveswei
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25 Apr 2011, 04:14 PM
Post #3
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yourmortgage.com.au
first offered non-conforming loans in 2004
http://replay.web.archive.org/20040701075511/http://www.yourmortgage.com.au/rates/
Home Loans Australia offered non-conforming loans in 2005
http://replay.web.archive.org/20050708143156/http://homeloansaustralia.com.au/nonconformingloans.htm
and still available
http://www.homeloansaustralia.com.au/nonconformingloans.htm
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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nasty
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25 Apr 2011, 08:04 PM
Post #4
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- raveswei
- 25 Apr 2011, 04:14 PM
do you actually read the shit you link to ? :laughing:
- Quote:
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Non Conforming Loans A non-conforming loan offers you finance when you don’t meet bank standard lending criteria. You can apply for a non-conforming loan if you own a property or have a deposit for a property. Borrowers that fit into this category include those who have an impaired credit history, such as judgements or defaults. - Quote:
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Loans are also categorised as non-conforming if properties do not fit standard criteria.
The wrong home loan could cost you a fortune – so it’s crucial to find the one that’s right for you. Applicant type - Individuals, Trusts. Employment requirements - P.A.Y.G. is O.K. Self-employed must be for one year Income: required proofs Payslips, group certificates or employer letter. Self-employed, two years tax returns. Loan amounts minimum & maximum $100k to $750,000 Purpose Specialised Securities
Some common types of specialized residential securities include;
* Company title property
* Multiple units on one title
* Studio apartments / 1 bed-sitter
* Inner City High Rise Apartments
* Managed Apartments
* Serviced Apartments
* Retirement units / over 50’s villages
* Hotel / Motel Conversions
* Warehouse Conversions
* Heritage Listed
* Holiday Rental
* Community Title
* Display Homes
* Resort Complex
* Over 55's Units* Minor Credit Issues Prime Loans are available up to 90% LVR to $650,000 for minor credit issues only Telco/Utility defaults ignored 1 up to $500 ** Major Credit related issues * Paid or unpaid defaults or Judgements up to $1,000 ignored * Paid or Unpaid Defaults or Judgements over 2 years ignored (any amount) * Unlimited credit enquiries allowed No undischarged bankrupts Maximum LVR on credit impaired loans is 90% of property value Coded, non-coded, or either - Either Variable, fixed or both - Both P&I, I/O, or both - Both Final LVR & Interest rate are dependant on location Lenders mortgage Insurance - Not required on loans below 80% LVR
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raveswei
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25 Apr 2011, 09:47 PM
Post #5
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- nasty
- 25 Apr 2011, 08:04 PM
do you actually read the shit you link to ? :laughing:
so what is your point?
or just another pointless post by nasty
Aussie (not me) claimed in 2007 that
- Quote:
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Up to 15% of home loans in Australia fall outside of traditional lending criteria. We are delighted to offer some great loan options to make home ownership possible for even more Australians.
- Quote:
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These products are great for customers who:
have had a one time incident or event such as an accident, illness, divorce or failed business that has led to financial difficulties and impaired their credit rating
are business owners who have not had the time to prepare or are unable to provide financial statements
fall outside bank policy guidelines
short term employment
gifted deposits
pension or welfare recipients
want to borrow more than 100% of the property value
this is sub-prime by any definition
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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barns
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25 Apr 2011, 10:07 PM
Post #6
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Even if we accept that Aussie does 15% sub-prime it is 15% of fa.
http://www.infochoice.com.au/home-loans/news/non-banks-winning-mortgage-market-share/39053/2/1,22,24,3,37
Lots of the non-big 4 lending is by credit unions and building societies and their lending criteria is usually more conservative than the big 4. That leaves fa of the market to belonging to any sub-prime definition.
= massive thread fail.
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Frank Castle
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25 Apr 2011, 10:10 PM
Post #7
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Business As Usual
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- raveswei
- 25 Apr 2011, 09:47 PM
I am such a dullard 
:laughing: You really are a thickie :laughing:
You have not read what nasty posted have you?
You need security and history of income, they will not lend to any fuckwit (subprime) as you make out
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The T.A.M.P.O.N effect - A NEW whinging bear acronym emerges
Timo And Moops Protest Over Nothing
Proof that moops is a simple minded hypocritical turnip
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peter fraser
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25 Apr 2011, 10:12 PM
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- raveswei
- 25 Apr 2011, 09:47 PM
this is sub-prime by any definition
on a percentage basis, there were very few true sub-prime loans written that fit the US style scenario.
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Rastus2
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26 Apr 2011, 12:28 AM
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- peter fraser
- 25 Apr 2011, 10:12 PM
on a percentage basis, there were very few true sub-prime loans written that fit the US style scenario.
I don't know that Australian and American mortgages can be easily compared...
A very large percentage of US mortgages were traditionally fixed.. and at amazingly low rates.
Details of what is available right now
Rates
Friday, April 22, 2011
Term & Type APR
15 Yr Fixed 4.227%
30 Yr Fixed 4.928%
40 Yr Fixed 5.113%
I mean really.. that is amazing, and the fact that Americans felt the need to go looking for other products which had (initially) lower rates tells me just how fanatic the speculation was... most home owners here in Oz would give their left arm for rates like the above..
Comparing Australian subprime to american subprime is like comparing road rules ... they are so very different despite being the same purpose that any direct comparison is difficult or impossible.
What is reasonable to compare is probably bell curves of how risk is being spread by lenders for loans... I doubt the risker loans that were being strongly encouraged in america are here in quite the same volume, but they certainly exist.
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Joye did not understand the functions of the RBA,
Joye did not read the ABS tables correctly
Joyd did not predict the most major financial collapse in the world since the great depression...
Keen can and has done all of the above... but Shadow is still blind to those simple facts, and he claims ..
- Shadow
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For the most part, Chris Joye's predictions have been quite accurate - certainly a lot closer to the mark than Steve Keen.
Love is Blind :c)
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raveswei
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26 Apr 2011, 09:36 AM
Post #10
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- Frank Castle
- 25 Apr 2011, 10:10 PM
You have not read what nasty posted have you?
You need security and history of income, they will not lend to any fuckwit (subprime) as you make out
quote from that website:
- Quote:
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A non-conforming loan offers you finance when you don’t meet bank standard lending criteria. You can apply for a non-conforming loan if you own a property or have a deposit for a property. Borrowers that fit into this category include those who have an impaired credit history, such as judgements or defaults.
Any mortgage given to someone who had recent default or bankruptcy is sub-prime.
You have a comprehension problem with your thinking that credit given to homeless people who recently defaulted is the only sub-prime.
Sub-prime is lending to anyone with impaired history of making repayments OR ability to make future repayments.
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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raveswei
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26 Apr 2011, 09:46 AM
Post #11
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- peter fraser
- 25 Apr 2011, 10:12 PM
on a percentage basis, there were very few true sub-prime loans written that fit the US style scenario.
I was not comparing our sub-prime with USA but what is "US style scenario"?
Every loan with LVR>80% and repayment >33% income is considered sub-prime in USA
Almost all FHB mortgages and all PI mortgages in Australia fall in this category.
it looks to me that word sub-prime is taboo, everybody is saying - yes, we have low lending standards but that is not sub-prime and when asked what is sub-prime they usually struggle and end up with the definition that sub-prime is only a million dollar mortgage given to homeless person.
All low-doc and No-doc loans that require "income declaration form" as a "proof" of income is sub-prime and there were many many such loans in Australia.
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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Sunder
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26 Apr 2011, 09:48 AM
Post #12
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- raveswei
- 26 Apr 2011, 09:36 AM
quote from that website:
Any mortgage given to someone who had recent default or bankruptcy is sub-prime.
You have a comprehension problem with your thinking that credit given to homeless people who recently defaulted is the only sub-prime.
Sub-prime is lending to anyone with impaired history of making repayments OR ability to make future repayments.
Remember that America had 3 ratings, which was even blurry between different banks there:
Prime
Alt-A
Sub-prime
Even if 15% of our mortgages don't meet traditional lending standards, that doesn't mean it's not a prime mortgage. And for those that definitely aren't prime, they could still be classified as "Alt-A" those would be mostly those with the demonstrated ability to pay, but below a 5-600 credit score (Generally means has defaulted recently).
Sub-prime could have meant anything from a NINJA loan, to interest amortised into capital loans, to "we're fudging the paperwork, because not even Columbian loan sharks with a lien on your healthy liver and heart is gonna give you a loan".
We can argue this till the cows come home, but without a strong defintion of a sub-prime loan that is strongly correlated to the first wave of involunatary defaults, it's not going to get us anywhere.
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Property speculation is a type of gambling... But everyone knows that in gambling, the house always wins in the end.
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raveswei
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26 Apr 2011, 09:51 AM
Post #13
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- barns
- 25 Apr 2011, 10:07 PM
You should read again:
- Quote:
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Up to 15% of home loans in Australia fall outside of traditional lending criteria. We are delighted to offer some great loan options to make home ownership possible for even more Australians.
It is very clear that 15% of all home loans in Australia "fall outside of traditional lending criteria."
they didn't say
up to 15% of home loans we (Aussie) issue fall outside of traditional lending criteria.
=massive post fail
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http://popping-bubble.blogspot.com/
Thinking of an Australian property speculator (PI):
Inaction = missing opportunities.
Missing opportunities = losing.
Too much thinking = inaction.
Thinking = missing opportunities.
Therefore thinking = losing.
disgraceful little man Frank Castle owes a house to Salvation Army
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Rastus2
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26 Apr 2011, 10:39 AM
Post #14
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- Frank Castle
- 25 Apr 2011, 10:10 PM
:laughing: You really are a thickie :laughing:
You have not read what nasty posted have you?
You need security and history of income, they will not lend to any fuckwit (subprime) as you make out
Many no-doc / lo-doc loans were issued in Australia without very good history... The laws on this were improved recently because so many dodgy loans were issued.
obviously you were not aware of this or you would not have made such a foolish attempt to mock raveswei.
big discussion @ ss on when these were reintroduced after being pulled from the market for being so dodgy by some lenders.
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Joye did not understand the functions of the RBA,
Joye did not read the ABS tables correctly
Joyd did not predict the most major financial collapse in the world since the great depression...
Keen can and has done all of the above... but Shadow is still blind to those simple facts, and he claims ..
- Shadow
-
For the most part, Chris Joye's predictions have been quite accurate - certainly a lot closer to the mark than Steve Keen.
Love is Blind :c)
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Frank Castle
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26 Apr 2011, 11:04 AM
Post #15
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Business As Usual
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- Rastus2
- 26 Apr 2011, 10:39 AM
Many no-doc / lo-doc loans were issued in Australia without very good history... The laws on this were improved recently because so many dodgy loans were issued.
Obviously you missed this bit in the first post on s/s
- Quote:
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NO DOCS to 75%
That means you need to stump up a big deposit
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obviously you were not aware of this
I was very aware of this
I used them myself, paid 30% deposit and higher interest rates on more than one deal
At the end of the day, it was hardly a bad deal for the bank and they were perfectly secure
They had my 30%
They had the property I was purchasing
How could the bank lose and subsequently fall over like the us banks did?
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or you would not have made such a foolish attempt to mock raveswei.
Foolish?
What was foolish was numbnuts attempt to say Australia had a problem
Even you disagreed with him
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I don't know that Australian and American mortgages can be easily compared...
Comparing Australian subprime to american subprime is like comparing road rules ... they are so very different despite being the same purpose that any direct comparison is difficult or impossible.
And now you look the fool for stepping back in to support his foolishness
and using a dodgy lender (that I have never heard of http://www.mortgage-mart.com.au/mortgagemart/index.php ) as an example of sub prime problems in Australia
What % of loans in Australia do you think Mortgage mart would have written?
Really rastus, this is nothing more than some piss poor baiting attempt on your part
It smacks of desperation if you or ravenswie think that a few loans, that are well covered as explained earlier, will in anyway have an affect of property prices or banks stability
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The T.A.M.P.O.N effect - A NEW whinging bear acronym emerges
Timo And Moops Protest Over Nothing
Proof that moops is a simple minded hypocritical turnip
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9:12 PM May 22
