Joe Hockey raises prospect of first home buyers using super to enter property market; Joe Hockey's plan for early access to super appeals to the young and the Greens
Tweet Topic Started: 6 Mar 2015, 06:31 PM (10,962 Views)
skamy You do not that the ABS methodology changed in 2006 and inc temp visa holders?
Pauk what you fail to see is that it does not matter.
Firstly, the change in 2006 was minor they always counted people staying more than 12 months, they just improved the method of estimating this. There is a break in the series due to this change but it does not actually effect the numbers to a significant degree. All they did is change from counting just continuous 12 stays to counting stays of 12 months within 16 months. 457s have been around since 1996 and as they are usually issued for 2-4 years they would have been part of the statistics since their introduction.
Secondly, many many of the 457s convert to permanent anyway. That is clear in the fact that the population continued to grow well after the big projects were winding up.
If you really believe all that population growth over the last decade is due to 457s who are due to fly off home anytime soon you really do live in cloud cuckoo land.
Definition of a doom and gloomer from 1993 The last camp is made up of the doom-and-gloomers. Their slogan is "it's the end of the world as we know it". Right now they are convinced that debt is the evil responsible for all our economic woes and must be eliminated at all cost. Many doom-and-gloomers believe that unprecedented debt levels mean that we are on the precipice of a worse crisis than the Great Depression. The doom-and-gloomers hang on the latest series of negative economic data.
Same here. I just put the minimum into super because by the time I get to access it they'll probably have raised the preservation age to 70. Super is a rort designed to prop up the share market and generate fees for super funds. I think people should be allowed to take it out and do whatever they want with it. Why should our own money be held ransom by the government, subject to ever changing rules, with no ability to access it until we're 60... 65... 70...? Many people will die before they ever get to touch their super, or be in such poor health that they can't enjoy the money.
Wow for once I am in complete agreement with you. Although I can see the rationale for super, most people are hopeless savers so it forces a large chunk of the population to set some money aside. Personally I would rather have access to the funds now, as you said the rules are constantly changing and I wouldn't be surprised if down the track governments take ever increasing raids of the populations super. If the government could be trusted to not change the rules perhaps a hybrid system would be good (although it would be an administrative nightmare) where people can access the funds but they can only be applied towards either property, ASX200 shares or government bonds, and the sale proceeds must go back into the trust account.
where people can access the funds but they can only be applied towards either property, ASX200 shares or government bonds, and the sale proceeds must go back into the trust account.
A few industry superannuation funds allow you to do this already. Not direct residential property yet. Certainly through listed property trusts.
The problem I have with superannuation and government bonds is there is a push to mandate that super funds must buy government bonds. What % of funds is unknown at this point the push is there.
For that to work they will have to stop lumpsum payments on retirement as the government will be taking the cash and using to fund spending and infrastructure and then paying a small percentage back in interest payments. Maybe 1% to 2% above RBA cash rate. As the money has been used to fund other things there would be insufficient liquidity in the super system to fund a large run of withdrawals so they would ban them and make you take a compulsory annuity or pension from your fund.
The older ones here would probably be alright, they may be able to access their super before these changes eventuate. Those of us that have more time to wait to access super are going to suffer through more and more meddling and changes with the system.
There are some people who seem angry and continuously look for conflict. Walk away, the battle they are fighting isn't with you, it's with themselves.
The first lesson of economics is scarcity: There is not enough of anything to satisfy all who want it. The first lesson of politics is to disregard the first lesson of economics. ~ Thomas Sowell.
Who was the fool, who the wise man, who the beggar or the Emperor? Whether rich or poor, all are equal in death.
A few industry superannuation funds allow you to do this already. Not direct residential property yet. Certainly through listed property trusts.
The problem I have with superannuation and government bonds is there is a push to mandate that super funds must buy government bonds. What % of funds is unknown at this point the push is there.
For that to work they will have to stop lumpsum payments on retirement as the government will be taking the cash and using to fund spending and infrastructure and then paying a small percentage back in interest payments. Maybe 1% to 2% above RBA cash rate. As the money has been used to fund other things there would be insufficient liquidity in the super system to fund a large run of withdrawals so they would ban them and make you take a compulsory annuity or pension from your fund.
The older ones here would probably be alright, they may be able to access their super before these changes eventuate. Those of us that have more time to wait to access super are going to suffer through more and more meddling and changes with the system.
I suppose also a SMSF is fairly close to what I'm describing. My proposal would have the income (if any) from the investments going to the individual, with the capital on sale of the asset to be returned to the trust account. While I don't like measures that prop up property prices in this instance I do feel that funds going towards a PPOR is a reasonable use of the funds (once again if the capital on sale is returned to the trust account) as it saves interest on your mortgage tax free and risk free (which would probably outperform a lot of fund managers).
Agreed Poontang on your second point and moves like this will just be the beginning I feel of governments playing with the ever increasing super balances to address government funding issues.
Maybe one could use their super to pay their own unemployment benefit should they find themselves out of work?
No shortage of things it could be used for throughout one's life if government really starts to look hard at that lovely big bucket of loot and gives it some thought.
Evidence for your 10-25% claim? Income tax wasn't 25% higher before Super was introduced.
That's why it was introduced. Super is a tax to pay for the long retirement of the baby boomers.
Retirees now have a lower mortality rate than those aged 45-55, which means that over the next 20 years, more GenX will die (and stop paying taxes as a consequence) than Baby Boomers will.
The government spends more per person on those aged 75-85 than on any other age cohort, and going forward will do so on a shrinking tax base.
Super could be used for anything really. To pay your aged pension obviously. To buy your house. To pay your unemployment benefit. Your children's school fees. Your child support. Your parent's retirement. Your child's sole parent benefit. Your children's unemployment benefit. Other peoples retirement. Other peoples accommodation. Other peoples children's school fees and child support and parent's retirements and children's sole parent benefits and unemployment benefits. And national infrastructure. Investments generally for the national benefit.
Things you might wish to see it used on; Things you might not wish to see it used on; Things a democratic society simply dictates it is desirable to see it used on. Pretty much anything at all quite obviously.
As can the equity you have in your home. Or any other assets you might think you own.
I think it's a good idea everyone needs to have a becks and lay down.
People will still accrue super after drawing it down to preservation age.
Being able to have the security if your own home is a good thing heading into retirement. If they don't do it now they will be drawing a lump sum and doing it at retirement anyway.
The super industry doesn't like the idea for obvious reasons.
The reality is the government is going to do fuck all for housing affordability because it means falling house prices which is politically unpopular.
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