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Joe Hockey raises prospect of first home buyers using super to enter property market; Joe Hockey's plan for early access to super appeals to the young and the Greens
Topic Started: 6 Mar 2015, 06:31 PM (10,963 Views)
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Joe Hockey's super idea not so super, say Paul Keating and industry chiefs

Super ideas pour petrol on fire in the housing market
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peter fraser
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I'd like to know why politicians have decided that they can play with the retirement savings of the individuals.
Any expressed market opinion is my own and is not to be taken as financial advice
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stinkbug
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peter fraser
10 Mar 2015, 06:10 PM
I'd like to know why politicians have decided that they can play with the retirement savings of the individuals.
This is one of the reasons I don't trust super.
---------------------------------------------------------------

While it's true that those who win never quit, and those who quit never win, those who never win and never quit are idiots.

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ThePauk
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It would never get through the Senate.
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Black Panther
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ThePauk
10 Mar 2015, 06:29 PM
It would never get through the Senate.
Wanna bet. Once both sides of Politics realize what a vote puller liberalizing how you can access it is, its open slather.


But dont worry, they will raise the pension age to 75+ by the time your kid is working.
Edited by Black Panther, 10 Mar 2015, 07:00 PM.
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Shadow
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stinkbug
10 Mar 2015, 06:16 PM
This is one of the reasons I don't trust super.
Same here. I just put the minimum into super because by the time I get to access it they'll probably have raised the preservation age to 70. Super is a rort designed to prop up the share market and generate fees for super funds. I think people should be allowed to take it out and do whatever they want with it. Why should our own money be held ransom by the government, subject to ever changing rules, with no ability to access it until we're 60... 65... 70...? Many people will die before they ever get to touch their super, or be in such poor health that they can't enjoy the money.
Edited by Shadow, 10 Mar 2015, 07:26 PM.
1. Epic Fail! Steve Keen's Bad Calls and Predictions.
2. Residential property loans regulated by NCCP Act. Banks can't margin call unless borrower defaults.
3. Housing is second highest taxed sector of Australian Economy. Renters subsidised by highly taxed homeowners.
4. Ongoing improvement in housing affordability. Australian household formation faster than population growth since 1960s.
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I wonder if we are beginning to reach some strange point in collective madness where both thinking bulls and thinking bears seem to be achieving some commonality of opinion?
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skamy
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b_b
9 Mar 2015, 03:13 PM
Look at Perth.

Average monthly approvals 2000-2004: 1,795
Average monthly approvals 2004-2009: 2,028
Average monthly approvals 2009-2013: 1,955
Average monthly approvals 2013-2015: 2,512
http://www.abs.gov.au/AUSSTATS/abs@.nsf/DetailsPage/8731.0Jan%202015?OpenDocument

Monthly supply up 40% on a month-by-month basis (from the early noughties). Yes, population increased, but additional supply would not have been created unless there was a profit margin (price > cost). So, have interest rate cuts helped Perth?

This idea that Supply is "restricted" and demand factors cause bubbles is complete rubbish. Supply has always responded in Australia.

Bubbles are created and "pop" when there is a supply response.
Those were rather selective little time periods b_b.


If you look at the total picture of dwelling approval response to population growth you will see a different story.
The following graph shows dwelling approvals together with population growth.

Posted Image

These figures are both from ABS.
Now you can see that there has been virtually no supply response other than a small uptick in 2010 since probably 2003/4 (maybe because that was when the GST for new builds was fully applied).

For the previous 2 decades supply responded to population growth. It does not take a genius to see that there is going to be pent up demand in WA, that the response of new building in 2014 will hardly dent.

The 2014 building levels are really just getting back to levels prior to all this population growth. Numbers of new builds were higher in 1988 when the population of WA was growing by 8000-12000 per quarter. We have just seen 7 years of growth running at between 10000 and 25000 per annum yet we have seen only one year building at the same numbers as we did back in 1988.

Do you believe that the people in Perth stopped wanting new homes in 2004? Will the people of Perth never return to building new homes at the rates they did the previous two decades?

I think that is highly unlikely.
peter fraser
10 Mar 2015, 06:10 PM
I'd like to know why politicians have decided that they can play with the retirement savings of the individuals.
Here here Peter.

It would be a renege on a deal. We added to our super savings account based on the taxation status we were offered. I doubt they can change it for existing super, it could probably be challenged successfully as a breach of contract.




Guest
10 Mar 2015, 08:45 PM
I wonder if we are beginning to reach some strange point in collective madness where both thinking bulls and thinking bears seem to be achieving some commonality of opinion?
:D
Edited by skamy, 10 Mar 2015, 08:53 PM.
Definition of a doom and gloomer from 1993
The last camp is made up of the doom-and-gloomers. Their slogan is "it's the end of the world as we know it". Right now they are convinced that debt is the evil responsible for all our economic woes and must be eliminated at all cost. Many doom-and-gloomers believe that unprecedented debt levels mean that we are on the precipice of a worse crisis than the Great Depression. The doom-and-gloomers hang on the latest series of negative economic data.
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Because it is a tax
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Shadow
10 Mar 2015, 07:25 PM
Why should our own money be held ransom by the government, subject to ever changing rules, with no ability to access it until we're 60... 65... 70...?
Because it is a tax. If not for super, income tax would be between 10-25% higher.
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ThePauk
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skamy
You do not that the ABS methodology changed in 2006 and inc temp visa holders?
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