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Hostages taken at Lindt Cafe, Martin Place. Forced to hold Islamic flag against window.
Topic Started: 15 Dec 2014, 10:25 AM (28,395 Views)
GloomBoomDoom
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http://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/pm-warns-of-terrorist-chatter-post-siege/story-e6frfku9-1227165493794
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
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peter fraser
23 Dec 2014, 11:31 AM
I don't believe that anyone is in favour of an open border. What this is about is a choice between zero immigration and others who are OK with some degree of immigration, and then there is Leo who has a real problem with a certain group who are from many races but he just lumps them all together under their religious beliefs.

Same thing happened years ago when Pauline Hansen stirred up debate over Vietnamese boat people. Now we accept them fully into our society.

It just takes time.
A bit of a misrepresentation of my views. I have argued against mass immigration and multiculturalism. This is the first thread I have ever mentioned Muslims on this forum and my main criticism is their unwillingness to integrate. It is simply not feasible to be true and loyal Muslim, and live in a Western Nation. It is not possible for a Muslim to integrate into a society that offends their sensibilities at every turn. And multiculturalism gives them licence and even encourages them to remain seperate and apart from the mainstream life of this nation. Multicultural theory flies in the face of reality and history and maintains that it is possible for such wildly incompatible cultures to cohabitate. If their is a more nationally destructive idea than multiculturalism I haven't heard it. If their is anything more socially destructive than mass immigration I haven't seen it






peter fraser
21 Dec 2014, 09:12 PM
It's your complete inability to see things from anything else but a very narrow perspective, and your constant fear of anything you see as different to you that I find gut wrenching.

You have a right to be that way, but I can't respect it.
BTW I notice you didn't really say exactly what it was that I said that upset you so much and why?

I posted:
Quote:
 
What about the Australian's that will never be born now because Australians need to compete for resources with these new arrivals and their offsprings and their offsprings offsprings? They'll never be in Australia now because we opened our doors. Like I said this celebration of the demise of your own lineage and ethnicity in your own country is a disease - 'I'm so open minded, non-racist and xenophilic i'll give away my country to prove it'.


To which you were moved to reply:
Quote:
 
Before I didn't really take much interest in immigration, I merely observed, but now I want 100 million before 2020.
Lets start a petition Leo - what do you say?
You and Doc Watson have convinced me.

Yep, lets start petitioning our politicians.
We can lift the rate of immigration to stratospheric levels - no problem.


What was it about this particular post that set you off?
Edited by Leodwald of Portsburgh, 23 Dec 2014, 08:36 PM.
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herbie
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
23 Dec 2014, 08:22 PM
A bit of a misrepresentation of my views. I have argued against mass immigration and multiculturalism. This is the first thread I have ever mentioned Muslims on this forum and my main criticism is their unwillingness to integrate. It is simply not feasible to be true and loyal Muslim, and live in a Western Nation. It is not possible for a Muslim to integrate into a society that offends their sensibilities at every turn. And multiculturalism gives them licence and even encourages them to remain seperate and apart from the mainstream life of this nation. Multicultural theory flies in the face of reality and history and maintains that it is possible for such wildly incompatible cultures to live cohabitate. If their is a more nationally destructive idea than multiculturalism I haven't heard it. If their is anything more socially destructive than mass immigration I haven't seen it


BTW I notice you didn't really say exactly what it was that I said that upset you so much and why?

I posted:

To which you were moved to reply:

What was it about my post that set you off?
You do seem to come across as a nationalist and a xenophobe Leo.
Now I kinda think I have some minimal understanding of nationalistic xenophobes perhaps? - No expert; Just some basic minimal understanding.
And can and do even respect them sometimes in various ways.
But it would seem to mean that you have a problem - Given as how you reside in a nation that just isn't especially nationalistic or especially xenophobic.
What do you do about your problem?
I'm not sure. And it's your decision to make/problem to figure out rather than mine anyway.
So best wishes with your attempts to work through your problem.
Hope you eventually come up with something that will prove workable for you 'n yours.
Edited by herbie, 23 Dec 2014, 09:20 PM.
A Professional Demographer to an amateur demographer: "negative natural increase will never outweigh the positive net migration"
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
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Ex BP Golly
23 Dec 2014, 11:11 AM
Poor old Closed-world.

Doesn't realise his religion has taken canabalism to a whole ritualised level, not just combining it with sacrifice, but sacrificing and eating your God.

That's seriously weird shit right there!
When have I ever said I was a Christian? Just more proof that you are responding to some cartoon character in your head and not anything real.

And for the record I have never partaken of the Eucharist and yes I agree with you, it seems a little wierd.
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herbie
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
23 Dec 2014, 09:32 PM
When have I ever said I was a Christian? Just more proof that you are responding to some cartoon character in your head and not anything real.

And for the record I have never partaken of the Eucharist and yes I agree with you, it seems a little wierd.
I know Christians who are OK - Some even who incline toward Catholicism ... Just no accounting for taste eh? :)
Edited by herbie, 23 Dec 2014, 11:11 PM.
A Professional Demographer to an amateur demographer: "negative natural increase will never outweigh the positive net migration"
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herbie
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I don't ever recall Oz being a monolithic monoculture.

In me olds' day Proddys didn't get jobs in Catholic businesses; Or vice versa.
'N the working class knew the 'cockies' (farmers) and 'bosses' (employers) were their 'enemies'.

And even in my day, the most basic nature of the town I grew up in could pretty much be boiled down to aligning with the names of the 4 A grade footy teams in the joint:

* The name of the river that flooded - As the blacks lived around there as the land was cheapest - And the blacks lived in the cheapest bits of town
* 'Brothers' - The Catholics played for that mob
* The name of an industry that employed lots of smelly/sweaty blue collar types
* The name of the region where the somewhat less smelly/sweaty white collar types were most likely ta buy their houses 'n live.

That's the Oz history that I know/grew up in - Along with all the nick names kids got for whatever reasons including the fact they didn't quite 'fit' - Though didn't get at all precious/destroyed by it as having been afforded a nick name was rather general sign of acceptance regardless. 'N by 'n large all those kids went on ta be what they'd be anyway.

So that was Oz in me old's day; 'N mine - Suck it up ... :re:

'N attempt ta 'improve' on it if 'n as we can I guess.

Edited by herbie, 24 Dec 2014, 09:15 AM.
A Professional Demographer to an amateur demographer: "negative natural increase will never outweigh the positive net migration"
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
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K-town
22 Dec 2014, 09:39 AM
So you think that the Irish and English who first settled in Australia were culturally the same?
Are you even white?

Look at the movement of the Irish into Scotland in the 1800's. The ructions still exist.

The Irish, English, Welsh and Scots were not the same culture. And therefore a multi-culture.
Not to mention the Chinese & various Europeans. Read the Eureka Stockade by Raffaello Carboni and take note of the surnames in the book.

Can someone please tell me when this egalitarian and altruistic Australia existed?

Posted Image

This countries first 200-odd years history after white settlement is rich white men stealing from the white poor. The mateship and fair go myth is propagated for the proles.
Depends on your definition of multicultural. Multiculturalism is a slippery ideology. There is a myriad of variations to the concept. This wealth of definitions is an advantage to the supporters of multiculturalism making it easy to deflect any attacks upon their viewpoint, by swapping, merging, and confusing definitions, and therefore dodge valid arguments and avoid being pinned down.

It is to stretch a long bow to consider people of the same race and broadly speaking same ethnicity from the same geographical location with similar histories, mythologies, archetypes and religion and underneath the surface a great deal of affection for each other coming together to build a nation as multicultural. It would be like calling a community of Australians and New Zealanders multicultural.

The ructions between Irish and Scottish stem from -surprise, surprise -massive immigration from Irish into Scotland. No people like being swamped by others in their own land and will rightfully resist it. People historically understood the threats this posed to their own peoples continued existence. Not so anymore. Modern westerners are suffering from a PC mental illness that welcomes their own demise in their own countries and attack anyone who dares get in the road.

The "fair go" ethos and the Australian Labor party grew out of the shearers strike of 1891 and was originally an appeal to the wealthy to give the Australian worker a fair go. Ironic that today the Australian Labor party of international fabian socialists believe it is their purpose to give the whole world a fair go in Australia and the fair go ethos has been co-opted by the wealthy and multiculturalists to mean giving the whole world a fair shot at Australia. How mass immigration and multiculturalism benefit the Australian worker is yet to be explained.
Edited by Leodwald of Portsburgh, 25 Dec 2014, 01:38 PM.
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herbie
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
24 Dec 2014, 11:24 PM
... The "fair go" ethos and the Australian Labor party grew out of the shearers strike of 1891 ...
One of my granddads was there - Barcaldine of course - Tree of Knowledge 'n all that shit - I believe? He was only 5. 'N there with his dad it's a pretty safe bet to assume. Whilst also assuming it was a significant enough event in even a 5 yos mind that he'd retain some sort of recollection of it. (Same ole boy was Light Horse in WWI - Bit long in the tooth by then; But got in 'n 'did his bit' regardless with that being the mindset back then I guess.) 'N a life long Socialist ta boot - Lord luv 'im ... :re:
Leodwald of Portsburgh
24 Dec 2014, 11:24 PM
How mass immigration and multiculturalism benefit the Australian worker is yet to be explained.
It just might contribute ta helping ta keep the Paukster type Taxationists off our backs/a touch subdued for a while longer yet?
'N I can only see that as a VERY good thing!
BIG AUSTRALIA SIMPLY HAS TO GET MY 'VOTE' - As one who identifies as a member of the worker/tax paying class.
Were any of your lot convicts Leo?
One of my great granddaddies was - Man was he a thieving piece of shit! - A gentleman's gentleman with a pocketful of skeleton keys what nicked a hundred quid (or was it guineas?) - But anyway 'invested maybe 10% of it in buying frilly knickers for his poke 'n took the other 90% down ta the bank 'n whacked it at 4% ... LOL! - Fuck I love my family history ... It's a scream - :D (Apples 'n trees; Apples 'n trees - As they say.)
Edited by herbie, 25 Dec 2014, 12:12 AM.
A Professional Demographer to an amateur demographer: "negative natural increase will never outweigh the positive net migration"
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herbie
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It's an interesting justification Leo; An interesting approach to history :

If the indigenous Aussies hadn't bin effed up the arse by the Anglos, the Japs would've effed 'em up the arse even harder ... :re:

Hmmm, but all that historical BS aside, I very actively favour high immigration/Big Australia now dude.
Edited by herbie, 25 Dec 2014, 09:59 PM.
A Professional Demographer to an amateur demographer: "negative natural increase will never outweigh the positive net migration"
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Leodwald of Portsburgh
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herbie
25 Dec 2014, 09:32 PM
It's an interesting justification Leo; An interesting approach to history :

If the indigenous Aussies hadn't bin effed up the arse by the Anglos, the Japs would've effed 'em up the arse even harder ... :re:

Hmmm, but all that historical BS aside, I very actively favour high immigration/Big Australia now dude.
A bit of a misrepresentation of my argument.

Quote:
 

Do you think in todays world, with Australias massive resources known about sitting here unprotected that every country in the world would leave a bunch of hunter gatherers in peace because it is the nice thing to do? If you answer no the only question left is who you would have preferred to colonise Australia. Well, who would you have preferred to colonise Australia?


The point is this country would have been colonised by someone by now. So who would you have preferred to colonise Australia, herbs?
I'd ask you why you "very actively favour high immigration/Big Australia now" but I'm sick of your senile little homilies.
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