Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]


Reply
Israel’s Assault on Gaza a 'Hideous Atrocity'
Topic Started: 11 Aug 2014, 07:47 AM (4,263 Views)
Dr Watson
Member Avatar


Chris
11 Aug 2014, 01:41 PM
1. What has this got to do with the Australian property market?
It may affect consumer confidence (at the margins) which could affect the property market.
Quote:
 
2. What do you know about the conflict between these two nations and surrounding nations? Personally I think you know very little but pls prove me wrong.
Me? Nothing. But every observer thinks he is an expert on Israel and Palestine.
Quote:
 
3. I would also love you to tell me what Israel should do to combat this very complexed situation, that's if you even understand what is happening around them?
Ever since Hitler targeted the Jews, they have adopted a siege mentality. It lives to this day.
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt — Bertrand Russell
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Sweetdish
Default APF Avatar


Black Panther
11 Aug 2014, 07:47 AM
Israel’s Assault on Gaza a 'Hideous Atrocity'





August 8, 2014 |

Hideous. Sadistic. Vicious. Murderous. That is how Noam Chomsky describes Israel’s 29-day offensive in Gaza that killed nearly 1,900 people and left almost 10,000 people injured. Chomsky has written extensively about the Israel/Palestine conflict for decades. After Israel’s Operation Cast Lead in 2008-2009, Chomsky co-authored the book "Gaza in Crisis: Reflections on Israel’s War Against the Palestinians" with Israeli scholar Ilan Pappé. His other books on the Israel/Palestine conflict include "Peace in the Middle East?: Reflections on Justice and Nationhood" and "The Fateful Triangle: The United States, Israel, and the Palestinians." Chomsky is a world-renowned political dissident, linguist and author, Institute Professor Emeritus at Massachusetts Institute of Technology, where he has taught for more than 50 years.

Below is a video intereview with Chomsky, followed by a transcript:

JUAN GONZÁLEZ: To talk more about the crisis in Gaza, we go now to Boston, where we are joined by Noam Chomsky, world-renowned political dissident, linguist, author, Institute Professor Emeritus at Massachusetts Institute of Technology, where he’s taught for more than 50 years. He has written extensively about the Israel-Palestine conflict for decades.

AMY GOODMAN: Forty years ago this month, Noam Chomsky published Peace in the Middle East?: Reflections on Justice and Nationhood. His 1983 book, The Fateful Triangle: The United States, Israel, and the Palestinians, is known as one of the definitive works on the Israel-Palestine conflict. Professor Chomsky joins us from Boston.

Welcome back to Democracy Now!, Noam. Please first just comment, since we haven’t spoken to you throughout the Israeli assault on Gaza. Your comments on what has just taken place?

NOAM CHOMSKY: It’s a hideous atrocity, sadistic, vicious, murderous, totally without any credible pretext. It’s another one of the periodic Israeli exercises in what they delicately call "mowing the lawn." That means shooting fish in the pond, to make sure that the animals stay quiet in the cage that you’ve constructed for them, after which you go to a period of what’s called "ceasefire," which means that Hamas observes the ceasefire, as Israel concedes, while Israel continues to violate it. Then it’s broken by an Israeli escalation, Hamas reaction. Then you have period of "mowing the lawn." This one is, in many ways, more sadistic and vicious even than the earlier ones.

JUAN GONZÁLEZ: And what of the pretext that Israel used to launch these attacks? Could you talk about that and to what degree you feel it had any validity?

NOAM CHOMSKY: As high Israeli officials concede, Hamas had observed the previous ceasefire for 19 months. The previous episode of "mowing the lawn" was in November 2012. There was a ceasefire. The ceasefire terms were that Hamas would not fire rockets—what they call rockets—and Israel would move to end the blockade and stop attacking what they call militants in Gaza. Hamas lived up to it. Israel concedes that.

In April of this year, an event took place which horrified the Israeli government: A unity agreement was formed between Gaza and the West Bank, between Hamas and Fatah. Israel has been desperately trying to prevent that for a long time. There’s a background we could talk about, but it’s important. Anyhow, the unity agreement came. Israel was furious. They got even more upset when the U.S. more or less endorsed it, which is a big blow to them. They launched a rampage in the West Bank.

What was used as a pretext was the brutal murder of three settler teenagers. There was a pretense that they were alive, though they knew they were dead. That allowed a huge—and, of course, they blamed it right away on Hamas. They have yet to produce a particle of evidence, and in fact their own highest leading authorities pointed out right away that the killers were probably from a kind of a rogue clan in Hebron, the Qawasmeh clan, which turns out apparently to be true. They’ve been a thorn in the sides of Hamas for years. They don’t follow their orders.

But anyway, that gave the opportunity for a rampage in the West Bank, arresting hundreds of people, re-arresting many who had been released, mostly targeted on Hamas. Killings increased. Finally, there was a Hamas response: the so-called rocket attacks. And that gave the opportunity for "mowing the lawn" again.

http://www.alternet.org/world/noam-chomsky-israels-assault-gaza-hideous-atrocity?paging=off&current_page=1#bookmark

Its easy of course to sit in the comfort of your home a whole world away from the conflict and air your opinions on the internet.
I would imagine that if you were living in israel your view would be different.

I personally don't know enough about life in Israel or Palestine to pass judgement either way.
However I suspect that if Sydney was surrounded by religious fanatics firing thousand of rockets randomly into our neighbourhoods, our view would be more in tune with that of Israel.
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Chris
Default APF Avatar


peter fraser
11 Aug 2014, 02:18 PM
We often discuss non-property related issues.

I think that BP has a right to ask a question on this subject and put it up for discussion.
Peter, he is not asking any questions he is just preaching ignorant views based on a first world sheltered view spoon fed to him by shock jocks, socialist parties and their elk.

He has no concern with recent human rights tragedies committed in the name of ideology which account for many more innocent civilians than the 1900 lives lost in Palestine. I just find it hard to stomach that someone with no skin in the game can offer up a staunched opinion based on little to no understanding of its complexity.

Do you have any ideas on Hezbollah, Hamas, ISIS you would like to share BP? Just to get an even spread, it would be interesting to see what your thoughts are on Hamas in particular, do you know their history and their goals surrounding the state of Israel?


Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Guest
Unregistered

They've been at it so long, it's about time to just turn a blind eye and let them have it out.................
"REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Dr Watson
Member Avatar


Chris
11 Aug 2014, 03:28 PM
I just find it hard to stomach that someone with no skin in the game can offer up a staunched opinion based on little to no understanding of its complexity.
Every observer — BP included — considers himself an authority on Gaza. You will find this among the intelligentsia everywhere. They all regard themselves experts on the Middle East.
The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt — Bertrand Russell
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Trojan
Default APF Avatar


Sweetdish
11 Aug 2014, 02:51 PM
Its easy of course to sit in the comfort of your home a whole world away from the conflict and air your opinions on the internet.
I would imagine that if you were living in israel your view would be different.

I personally don't know enough about life in Israel or Palestine to pass judgement either way.
However I suspect that if Sydney was surrounded by religious fanatics firing thousand of rockets randomly into our neighbourhoods, our view would be more in tune with that of Israel.
Completely agree.
If our neighbours kept firing rockets at our towns and publicly announced they won't stop until we were completely destroyed, I would insist our government do everything it can to defend us - even if it means firing back.
Edited by Trojan, 11 Aug 2014, 04:22 PM.
I put trolls and time wasters on my ignore list so if I don't respond to you, you are probably on it ....
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
peter fraser
Member Avatar


Chris
11 Aug 2014, 03:28 PM
Peter, he is not asking any questions he is just preaching ignorant views based on a first world sheltered view spoon fed to him by shock jocks, socialist parties and their elk.
No doubt and I have clashed with BP in the past here and elsewhere over his views, but I accept his right to discuss what is a significant current event, and express his view on it.

It's up to Alex not you and I to rule on what is acceptable or not, and so far the discussion has been civil. Of course that could change quickly here.




Any expressed market opinion is my own and is not to be taken as financial advice
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Veritas
Default APF Avatar


Trojan
11 Aug 2014, 04:19 PM
Completely agree.
If our neighbours kept firing rockets at our towns and publicly announced they won't stop until we were completely destroyed, I would insist our government do everything it can to defend us - even if it means firing back.
The analogy is false.

Unless you would call the inmates of an open air prison you control your neighbours?
Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?

The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly.
Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Black Panther
Default APF Avatar


Chris
11 Aug 2014, 03:28 PM
Peter, he is not asking any questions he is just preaching ignorant views based on a first world sheltered view spoon fed to him by shock jocks, socialist parties and their elk.

He has no concern with recent human rights tragedies committed in the name of ideology which account for many more innocent civilians than the 1900 lives lost in Palestine. I just find it hard to stomach that someone with no skin in the game can offer up a staunched opinion based on little to no understanding of its complexity.

Do you have any ideas on Hezbollah, Hamas, ISIS you would like to share BP? Just to get an even spread, it would be interesting to see what your thoughts are on Hamas in particular, do you know their history and their goals surrounding the state of Israel?

Re "He has no concern with recent human rights tragedies committed in the name of ideology"

Brainwashed twit. I have more compassion in my little finger then you have in your whole person.

Its all over the media because of just how bad the Israeli's are treating innocents with their horse shit notion of collective punishment.

What a pathetic joke you truely are.

Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
Chris
Default APF Avatar


Dr Watson
11 Aug 2014, 03:34 PM
Every observer — BP included — considers himself an authority on Gaza. You will find this among the intelligentsia everywhere. They all regard themselves experts on the Middle East.
Agreed Doc, I am no expert so I try to keep my views to myself for the best part. I do however get a bit strange about others who have a one dimensional view of such complexed matters and are by extension of that puppets in a very messy conflict.

One day, maybe not to far from now these issues will find their way closer to home for BP and then he will understand the situation in Gaza a little better.




Black Panther
11 Aug 2014, 05:57 PM
Re "He has no concern with recent human rights tragedies committed in the name of ideology"

Brainwashed twit. I have more compassion in my little finger then you have in your whole person.

Its all over the media because of just how bad the Israeli's are treating innocents with their horse shit notion of collective punishment.

What a pathetic joke you truely are.
I am not saying you don't have compassion, you clearly care about the innocent being caught up in a situation they are trapped and unable avoid, you would not be human if you didn't. Do you truly believe that I do not care about the civilian casualties in Gaza?

What I am asking you to do is open your mind beyond a one dimensional conflict, explore the origins of Hamas the impact they have had in Gaza and there roll in this conflict and then you may start to understand why your comments are, for the best part, misguided.
Edited by Chris, 11 Aug 2014, 06:25 PM.
Profile "REPLY WITH QUOTE" Go to top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
ZetaBoards - Free Forum Hosting
Enjoy forums? Start your own community for free.
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Australian Property Forum · Next Topic »
Reply



Australian Property Forum is an economics and finance forum dedicated to discussion of Australian and global real estate markets and macroeconomics, including house prices, housing affordability, and the likelihood of a property crash. Is there an Australian housing bubble? Will house prices crash, boom or stagnate? Is the Australian property market a pyramid scheme or Ponzi scheme? Can house prices really rise forever? These are the questions we address on Australian Property Forum, the premier real estate site for property bears, bulls, investors, and speculators. Members may also discuss matters related to finance, modern monetary theory (MMT), debt deflation, cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin Ethereum and Ripple, property investing, landlords, tenants, debt consolidation, reverse home equity loans, the housing shortage, negative gearing, capital gains tax, land tax and macro prudential regulation.

Forum Rules: The main forum may be used to discuss property, politics, economics and finance, precious metals, crypto currency, debt management, generational divides, climate change, sustainability, alternative energy, environmental topics, human rights or social justice issues, and other topics on a case by case basis. Topics unsuitable for the main forum may be discussed in the lounge. You agree you won't use this forum to post material that is illegal, private, defamatory, pornographic, excessively abusive or profane, threatening, or invasive of another forum member's privacy. Don't post NSFW content. Racist or ethnic slurs and homophobic comments aren't tolerated. Accusing forum members of serious crimes is not permitted. Accusations, attacks, abuse or threats, litigious or otherwise, directed against the forum or forum administrators aren't tolerated and will result in immediate suspension of your account for a number of days depending on the severity of the attack. No spamming or advertising in the main forum. Spamming includes repeating the same message over and over again within a short period of time. Don't post ALL CAPS thread titles. The Advertising and Promotion Subforum may be used to promote your Australian property related business or service. Active members of the forum who contribute regularly to main forum discussions may also include a link to their product or service in their signature block. Members are limited to one actively posting account each. A secondary account may be used solely for the purpose of maintaining a blog as long as that account no longer posts in threads. Any member who believes another member has violated these rules may report the offending post using the report button.

Australian Property Forum complies with ASIC Regulatory Guide 162 regarding Internet Discussion Sites. Australian Property Forum is not a provider of financial advice. Australian Property Forum does not in any way endorse the views and opinions of its members, nor does it vouch for for the accuracy or authenticity of their posts. It is not permitted for any Australian Property Forum member to post in the role of a licensed financial advisor or to post as the representative of a financial advisor. It is not permitted for Australian Property Forum members to ask for or offer specific buy, sell or hold recommendations on particular stocks, as a response to a request of this nature may be considered the provision of financial advice.

Views expressed on this forum are not representative of the forum owners. The forum owners are not liable or responsible for comments posted. Information posted does not constitute financial or legal advice. The forum owners accept no liability for information posted, nor for consequences of actions taken on the basis of that information. By visiting or using this forum, members and guests agree to be bound by the Zetaboards Terms of Use.

This site may contain copyright material (i.e. attributed snippets from online news reports), the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. Such content is posted to advance understanding of environmental, political, human rights, economic, democratic, scientific, and social justice issues. This constitutes 'fair use' of such copyright material as provided for in section 107 of US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed for research and educational purposes only. If you wish to use this material for purposes that go beyond 'fair use', you must obtain permission from the copyright owner. Such material is credited to the true owner or licensee. We will remove from the forum any such material upon the request of the owners of the copyright of said material, as we claim no credit for such material.

For more information go to Limitations on Exclusive Rights: Fair Use

Privacy Policy: Australian Property Forum uses third party advertising companies to serve ads when you visit our site. These third party advertising companies may collect and use information about your visits to Australian Property Forum as well as other web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services of interest to you. If you would like more information about this practice and to know your choices about not having this information used by these companies, click here: Google Advertising Privacy FAQ

Australian Property Forum is hosted by Zetaboards. Please refer also to the Zetaboards Privacy Policy