Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 shot down. 295 dead including 27 Australians.; Malaysia Airlines plane en route from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur shot down by surface-to-air missile
Tweet Topic Started: 18 Jul 2014, 08:23 AM (15,154 Views)
A Malaysia Airlines plane en route from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur has been shot down in separatist-controlled eastern Ukraine, claiming the lives of 295 passengers and crew. Malaysia Airlines told Fairfax Media that 27 Australians were on board.
Australia's Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade said it was investigating "a number" of Australians abroad the Boeing 777.
Bodies and burning wreckage were scattered over the countryside near Donetsk.
There were also reports of 23 US and nine UK passengers. The flight carried a crew of 15.
US intelligence officials confirmed to American media that a surface-to-air missile brought down the airline. However, which side used the missile was less clear, officials said.
Eastern Ukraine has been roiled for months by a violent pro-Russian separatist uprising in which a number of military aircraft have been downed. But this would be the first commercial airline disaster to result from the hostilities. Despite the turmoil in eastern Ukraine, the commercial airspace over that part of the country is a heavily trafficked route and has remained open.
Malaysia Airlines, still reeling from the mysterious loss of another Boeing 777 flight in March, confirmed that Ukrainian air traffic control lost contact with flight MH17 at 1415 (GMT), approximately 50km from the Russia-Ukraine border.
Flight MH17 operated on a Boeing 777 left Amsterdam at 12.15pm (Amsterdam local time) and was estimated to arrive at Kuala Lumpur International Airport at 6.10 am (Malaysia local time) the next day.
Online videos showed thick plumes of smoke coming from the crash site.
Ukraine officials and anti-Russian activists claimed it was shot down by a surface-to-air missile launched by pro-Russian separatists, with one media report blaming Russian-backed Cossack militants. Reports in Russian media pointed to the Ukrainian military.
The ‘Buk’ anti-aircraft missile system, manufactured in Russia, can hit aircraft up to an altitude of 25km.
On June 29 the Itar-Tass news agency reported that Donetsk People's Republic separatists had taken control of a missile defence unit equipped with Buk missile systems.
Within hours of the crash, Ukrainian media have reported blamed Russian-backed Cossack militants, publishing what the Kyiv Post said was the content of a phone call between members of Russian-backed militant groups, intercepted by Ukraine's security agency.
The phone call was made 20 minutes after the plane crash, the Kyiv Post reported, by Igor Bezler, military commander of the separatist Donetsk People's Republic.
He was said to be reporting to a Russian army colonel in their intelligence department.
In a transcript of the conversation Bezler says "We have just shot down a plane".
A civilian aircraft should not have been flying over what is effectively a war zone where missiles are being fired regularly.
It was considered safe. A comment that one airline expert made was that it saved fuel to fly over this space. He said that "we get what we pay for" meaning that some airlines avoid this type of risky airspace but the fuel cost is higher, and therefore the seat cost is higher.
I guess this is what happens when we get drunken poorly trained Russian separatists in Ukraine equipped with sophisticated surface to air missiles.
I would expect some serious repercussions over this act.
Any expressed market opinion is my own and is not to be taken as financial advice
I think we can certainly assume the plane was shot down.
This is where things will get murky, and there will be nowhere for them to get murkier than Eastern Ukraine.
I would observe that the Ukraine rebels have not shown any air capability yet so it is unlikely the Ukraine military shot down the aircraft as a mistake.
The rebels certainly have been shooting down aircraft. These have been aircraft flying at low levels within direct line of sight in Eastern Ukraine (as opposed to those cruising at 10000 metres)
This is something the Ukraine government has been trying to highlight. For mine it would boil down to maybe the Ukraine government wanting to draw extra attention to their calls for the rest of the world to do something about the rebels, against possibly rebels trying to make a point they can shoot down things they don't need to.
There are certainly some hard core issues and players involved here, involving both sides. Both capable of considerable brutality.
The Oligarchs in Ukraine are stepping up their fight over the spoils of ousting the previous regime
Maybe one of them sees an advantage in bringing attention to the region.
Those sanctions announced by the US the other day against Russian companies are utterly meaningless – essentially sanctions again 4 companies which won't feel them.
Another classic example of the ‘west’ needing to be seen to do something without doing something. And I would further point in the direction of the recent donations to the UK conservatives from one Andrei Borodin (formerly Bank of Moscow who did a runner to UK – latest in a long line). Essentially the ‘west’ is all about looking after those hard core people and not touching their wealth.
Australian Property Forum is an economics and finance forum dedicated to discussion of Australian and global real estate markets and macroeconomics, including house prices, housing affordability, and the likelihood of a property crash. Is there an Australian housing bubble? Will house prices crash, boom or stagnate? Is the Australian property market a pyramid scheme or Ponzi scheme? Can house prices really rise forever? These are the questions we address on Australian Property Forum, the premier real estate site for property bears, bulls, investors, and speculators. Members may also discuss matters related to finance, modern monetary theory (MMT), debt deflation, cryptocurrencies like Bitcoin Ethereum and Ripple, property investing, landlords, tenants, debt consolidation, reverse home equity loans, the housing shortage, negative gearing, capital gains tax, land tax and macro prudential regulation.
Forum Rules:
The main forum may be used to discuss property, politics, economics and finance, precious metals, crypto currency, debt management, generational divides, climate change, sustainability, alternative energy, environmental topics, human rights or social justice issues, and other topics on a case by case basis. Topics unsuitable for the main forum may be discussed in the lounge. You agree you won't use this forum to post material that is illegal, private, defamatory, pornographic, excessively abusive or profane, threatening, or invasive of another forum member's privacy. Don't post NSFW content. Racist or ethnic slurs and homophobic comments aren't tolerated. Accusing forum members of serious crimes is not permitted. Accusations, attacks, abuse or threats, litigious or otherwise, directed against the forum or forum administrators aren't tolerated and will result in immediate suspension of your account for a number of days depending on the severity of the attack. No spamming or advertising in the main forum. Spamming includes repeating the same message over and over again within a short period of time. Don't post ALL CAPS thread titles. The Advertising and Promotion Subforum may be used to promote your Australian property related business or service. Active members of the forum who contribute regularly to main forum discussions may also include a link to their product or service in their signature block. Members are limited to one actively posting account each. A secondary account may be used solely for the purpose of maintaining a blog as long as that account no longer posts in threads. Any member who believes another member has violated these rules may report the offending post using the report button.
Australian Property Forum complies with ASIC Regulatory Guide 162 regarding Internet Discussion Sites. Australian Property Forum is not a provider of financial advice. Australian Property Forum does not in any way endorse the views and opinions of its members, nor does it vouch for for the accuracy or authenticity of their posts. It is not permitted for any Australian Property Forum member to post in the role of a licensed financial advisor or to post as the representative of a financial advisor. It is not permitted for Australian Property Forum members to ask for or offer specific buy, sell or hold recommendations on particular stocks, as a response to a request of this nature may be considered the provision of financial advice.
Views expressed on this forum are not representative of the forum owners. The forum owners are not liable or responsible for comments posted. Information posted does not constitute financial or legal advice. The forum owners accept no liability for information posted, nor for consequences of actions taken on the basis of that information. By visiting or using this forum, members and guests agree to be bound by the Zetaboards Terms of Use.
This site may contain copyright material (i.e. attributed snippets from online news reports), the use of which has not always been specifically authorized by the copyright owner. Such content is posted to advance understanding of environmental, political, human rights, economic, democratic, scientific, and social justice issues. This constitutes 'fair use' of such copyright material as provided for in section 107 of US Copyright Law. In accordance with Title 17 U.S.C. Section 107, the material on this site is distributed for research and educational purposes only. If you wish to use this material for purposes that go beyond 'fair use', you must obtain permission from the copyright owner. Such material is credited to the true owner or licensee. We will remove from the forum any such material upon the request of the owners of the copyright of said material, as we claim no credit for such material.
Privacy Policy: Australian Property Forum uses third party advertising companies to serve ads when you visit our site. These third party advertising companies may collect and use information about your visits to Australian Property Forum as well as other web sites in order to provide advertisements about goods and services of interest to you. If you would like more information about this practice and to know your choices about not having this information used by these companies, click here: Google Advertising Privacy FAQ
Australian Property Forum is hosted by Zetaboards. Please refer also to the Zetaboards Privacy Policy