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Baby Boomers Are Evil - visit Reform Australian Housing on Facebook; I bought a house a year ago, paid some snivelling undeserving ageing hippy boomer far more than they deserved
Topic Started: 11 Jul 2014, 02:01 PM (10,206 Views)
Bardon
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herbie
13 Jul 2014, 03:41 PM
Twaddle - The RBA dropped interest rates to quite intentionally push housing prices up.
I know they sold a house recently, not sure how many they are buying at increased prices though.
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Veritas
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Bardon
13 Jul 2014, 03:36 PM
I'm not so sure that we should be pointing the figures at bankers, politicians and the like when discussing housing reform. The market is determined by the free choices that buyers and sellers make. You may find these personal choices irrational but they are made by the individual and no one else.
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Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?

The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly.
Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
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Bardon
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That reminds me of that first multicultural coke advert.

Anyway I just got out a tight squeeze there. A couple of banking and government standover men were trying to force me to sell one of my houses for a gain, is this what its come to?
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Count du Monet
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I'm not so sure that we should be pointing the figures at bankers, politicians and the like when discussing housing reform. The market is determined by the free choices that buyers and sellers make. You may find these personal choices irrational but they are made by the individual and no one else.


You mean currency that devalues at 5% pa and banks at ZIRP returns is a choice of Joe Public?

If the currency became gold house prices would plummet 50%. Indeed fiat currency was forced on the public with threats of huge fines and 10 years in jail.

This was the choice of evil smelly banksters and not the public.
The next trick of our glorious banks will be to charge us a fee for using net bank!!!
You are no longer customer, you are property!!!

Don't be SAUCY with me Bernaisse
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Bardon
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No, I mean that the housing market is determined by willing buyers and sellers. Those seeking housing reforms best understand that transaction first and then decide how they want to attempt to influence change.

Blaming the banks and the government for your woes is a dead set sign that your woes will continue.
Edited by Bardon, 13 Jul 2014, 05:30 PM.
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Veritas
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Bardon
13 Jul 2014, 05:26 PM
No, I mean that the housing market is determined by willing buyers and sellers. Those seeking housing reforms best understand that transaction first and then decide how they want to attempt to influence change.

Blaming the banks and the government for your woes is a dead set sign that your woes will continue.
And the housing market in Dublin 2006 was replete with willing buyers and sellers.

Is that where the story ends in your view?

Does the fact that Government was governing, that regulators weren't regulating and banks were making out like bandits totally irrelevant in terms of what happened next?

Your argument is not at all dissimilar to the one rich people make against the poor when they use the notion of personal responsibility to neutralise the very real impediments posed by inequality.

"Its your fault you are poor buddy, its up to you to change it!" :re:



Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?

The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly.
Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
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Bardon
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So how come I got wealthy then?
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Veritas
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Bardon
13 Jul 2014, 05:44 PM
So how come I got wealthy then?
Haven't a clue.

Usually involves a nice portion of luck though.
Property acquisition as a topic was almost a national obsession. You couldn't even call it speculation as the buyers all presumed the price of property could only go up. That’s why we use the word obsession. Ordinary people were buying properties for their young children who had not even left school assuming they would not be able to afford property of their own when they left college- Klaus Regling on Ireland. Sound familiar?

The evidence of nearly 40 cycles in house prices for 17 OECD economies since 1970 shows that real house prices typically give up about 70 per cent of their rise in the subsequent fall, and that these falls occur slowly.
Morgan Kelly:On the Likely Extent of Falls in Irish House Prices, 2007
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Bardon
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Veritas
13 Jul 2014, 05:45 PM
Haven't a clue.

Usually involves a nice portion of luck though.
Fair enough but it certainly wasn't due to banker and government support either, quit the opposite in fact. Just because I am making the point that blaming bankers and the government is an ineffective strategy for (insert any protest from a naive group that wont get legs here), doesn't mean that I like them either.
Veritas
13 Jul 2014, 05:42 PM
And the housing market in Dublin 2006 was replete with willing buyers and sellers.



I know many Irishmen that got caught in that. One in particular is in the hole for an awful lot (he is till a CFO here), he actually told me that he read a book pre-crash and the first chapter had a picture of a porsche in some bog Irish car park. He knew then that it was flawed and intentionally put the book down and didn't finish it. You cant blame the Gmen for that can you?

I had my suspicions when good IT guys were leaving Oz at the turn of the century for Dublin for lifestyle and career opportunities!

I have been to Ireland on many occasions.

Anyway my suspicions started in the late nineties when I took my wife there to see how tough it was and in a sense experience the movie the Commitments. Only to be served by European waiters, wanky and expensive menus and tablecloths ffs, Ireland used to only export linens. This was far different to my earlier experiences at the Guinness Jazz festival in Cork.

I was in Derry last year and noted how well it had recovered even though NI was actually the most blighted buy the housing boom.

You obviously know some Irishmen or maybe are one, therefore go and have chat to those that never bought, it was peer pressure to buy and fear of missing out, the gmen and the bankers didn't make the call whatsoever. The Irish government and the Irish banks were corrupt as hell, no doubt about it, but I don't blame them.
Edited by Bardon, 13 Jul 2014, 06:13 PM.
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zaph
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ThePauk
13 Jul 2014, 12:27 PM

Noted on your political realism to my proposals, however,
No house flipping becomes worthwhile when a full CGT applies and land bankers are penalised via the land tax.

We also need a well designed death tax. I suggest that any individual who inherits more than $750,000 is to pay 25% on the amount over the $750,000. Exemptions for rural and ongoing business assets.

Herbs
Nothing socilaistic in anti-speculation controls on house price inflation.
Please note Herbs we are a socialist nation with welfare, free education and free health. You might be against Communism perhaps?
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Yep no CGT for investors also after 10 years. No stamps so as not to penalise those who move after the ten years. It works in Germany.
Exactly, you want people to hold longer. That is the point.


One should want people to hold property as long as it's appropriate for them to do so, not some arbitrary period of ten years. Why should we provide investors a tax free gain if they hold for 10 years, instead of 3468 days?

This is not Germany! We had a German intern at work - he much rather preferred our system of renting. He could rent a place for the year he was here and only pay the rent. In Germany he would have had to install his own kitchen and bathroom.

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strong anti-speculation is required to put a lid finally on house price inflation.


None of your policies would put a lid on house price inflation.


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