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Gold was in a bubble, but now it's going to have its first losing year for 13 years; Gold and Bitcoin Aren’t So Different After All
Topic Started: 10 Dec 2013, 10:16 PM (4,642 Views)
goldbug
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stinkbug
11 Dec 2013, 10:39 AM
I'll have to disagree with this view.

Property can be cashflow positive immediately it is bought (rare but possible), can be renovated to make it cashflow positive immediately on completion of work (possible but requires some brains), or can be chosen to be cashflow positive within 3-5 years (not hard at all).
Of course. And gold can be bought at the right time and sold for a 100% profit in a couple of years but like your example, it rarely happens.

My point is still valid though. Unless you spend a small fortune along the way an investment property will slip so far out of fashion that it will become undesirable as a rental and fetch a lot less on sale than other properties around it. Units suffer their own degradation problems but these are unavoidable. A 30 year old unit complex is a 30 year old unit complex and adding some stucco and new carpets wont change that.
Catweasel
11 Dec 2013, 02:22 PM
Catweasel say a gold the miner,

in a Japan,

up a 30% in a 2013.

Not the sure how it can the be,
INFLATION

Although the central bank had made its clear that the unprecedented monetary easing rolled out in April isn’t meant to guide the yen lower to shore up growth, the BOJ sees a lower domestic currency as a boon for the economy to overcome years of declining prices.
http://blogs.wsj.com/japanrealtime/2013/12/11/boj-watch-yens-fall-a-boon-for-bojs-bid-for-inflation-target/
Edited by goldbug, 12 Dec 2013, 06:23 AM.
Shadow was hopelessly wrong about the Gold Bull Market.
What else is he wrong about?
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Frank Castle
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Business As Usual

Poontang
11 Dec 2013, 06:11 PM
Just because it leaves you out does not mean it COULD not happen.
Lots of things COULD happen

At the end of the day, gambling, is not investing.
goldbug
12 Dec 2013, 06:18 AM
My point is still valid though. Unless you spend a small fortune along the way an investment property will slip so far out of fashion that it will become undesirable as a rental and fetch a lot less on sale than other properties around it.
All depends on Zoning. ;)
Edited by Frank Castle, 12 Dec 2013, 08:55 AM.
Ignore posts by The Whole Truth · View Post · End Ignoring
The forum fuckwit goes RRRAAARRRGGHHhhh - But not a fuck was given..................by anyone.
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propertymogul
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Poontang
11 Dec 2013, 06:15 PM
I like NST too, with being a dividend paying Gold Miner as well (around 5%) and the added bonus of the recent coal find (sale of coal assets could fund expansion or bring a capital return payment in the future)


I also like BDR

Nothing goes up in a straight line forever, you have said as much your self on this forum Timmy.

You have your opinion that gold is finished.. I, and others think it will continue the bull run up and have put our money up on that belief.

I am of the view is that gold and silver will go up far more over the next 3 or so years than it has fallen in the last 2 or so by some margin and have added to my PM holdings
Thanks Poontang, BDR hadn't crossed my radar, but after an initial look I think it has huge potential. Based on the Sep qtr cash flow numbers and the increasing volumes being extracted it looks cheap. Will do a little more research first but thanks for bringing it to my attention.
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stinkbug
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goldbug
12 Dec 2013, 06:18 AM
Of course. And gold can be bought at the right time and sold for a 100% profit in a couple of years but like your example, it rarely happens.

My point is still valid though. Unless you spend a small fortune along the way an investment property will slip so far out of fashion that it will become undesirable as a rental and fetch a lot less on sale than other properties around it. Units suffer their own degradation problems but these are unavoidable. A 30 year old unit complex is a 30 year old unit complex and adding some stucco and new carpets wont change that.
I have to disagree.

Two things:

1) Property is not like gold, in that different properties have different characteristics. You can choose something high yield or low yield, something new or old, something that needs work or doesn't, differing locations, differing size, different inclusions and layout, etc. It is these characteristics that enable you to choose a higher performing property (which admittedly takes time and effort to learn how to do). Once you know how to do this, it's not rare at all. In fact, as you get better at it and your portfolio grows you eventually get to a point where picking winners is actually pretty easy.

2) Fashion and property returns do not go hand in hand. Having a 30 year old property does not mean that it's worthless or undesirable. Some of my best performing investments are older properties. Yes, a 30 year old unit complex is 30 years old, but you can assess it's structural quality, and you can renovgate it easily, and you can choose what you pay. Choosing what you pay is a huge differentiator between property and other asset classes.
---------------------------------------------------------------

While it's true that those who win never quit, and those who quit never win, those who never win and never quit are idiots.

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Count du Monet
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Frank Castle
12 Dec 2013, 08:53 AM


At the end of the day, gambling, is not investing
2 sovereigns was a weeks basic wage a century ago. Today it is still a weeks basic wage, where's the gamble?
Edited by Count du Monet, 13 Dec 2013, 03:00 PM.
The next trick of our glorious banks will be to charge us a fee for using net bank!!!
You are no longer customer, you are property!!!

Don't be SAUCY with me Bernaisse
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Pig Iron
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Bogan scum

Count du Monet
13 Dec 2013, 03:00 PM
2 sovereigns was a weeks basic wage a century ago. Today it is still a weeks basic wage, where's the gamble?
where's the profit. you are effectively saying gold has been a loser for 100 years.
I am the love child of Tony Abbott and Pauline Hanson
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Count du Monet
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Pig Iron
13 Dec 2013, 03:34 PM
where's the profit. you are effectively saying gold has been a loser for 100 years.
You can only get a profit if you loan it to somebody for a return. The central banks have gold lending stitched up having something like 30,000 tons om loan to the jewelery market. They charge the libor rate plus the lease rate and the interest is payable in gold itself.

If one wishes to play the market that is what Commex is for with gold futures. However there much bigger and smarter people on that table on the look out for more suckers. The best the little guy can do is buy and hold for longer term. Gambling precisely because the opposition is bigger and smarter and views you as lunch.

The important point with gold is liquidity, if you want it fast you can do that. It is uniform and can be shipped all over the world.
The next trick of our glorious banks will be to charge us a fee for using net bank!!!
You are no longer customer, you are property!!!

Don't be SAUCY with me Bernaisse
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